On this bonus episode of SWR, Jason & Laura chat about The Ones We’re Meant to Find, a beautifully-written young adult dystopian scifi by Joan He. Listen in as we discuss two very different sisters and their struggles living in a world ravaged by climate change. We also talk about that surprise twist, compare this book to a couple different Disney films, and chat about… Elon Musk??? Tune in to find out what that’s about.
Goodreads Synopsis
One of the most twisty, surprising, engaging page-turner YAs you’ll read this year—We Were Liars meets Black Mirror, with a dash of Studio Ghibli.
Cee has been trapped on an abandoned island for three years without any recollection of how she arrived, or memories from her life prior. All she knows is that somewhere out there, beyond the horizon, she has a sister named Kay, and it’s up to Cee to cross the ocean and find her.
In a world apart, 16-year-old STEM prodigy Kasey Mizuhara lives in an eco-city built for people who protected the planet―and now need protecting from it. With natural disasters on the rise due to climate change, eco-cities provide clean air, water, and shelter. Their residents, in exchange, must spend at least a third of their time in stasis pods, conducting business virtually whenever possible to reduce their environmental footprint. While Kasey, an introvert and loner, doesn’t mind the lifestyle, her sister Celia hated it. Popular and lovable, Celia much preferred the outside world. But no one could have predicted that Celia would take a boat out to sea, never to return.
Now it’s been three months since Celia’s disappearance, and Kasey has given up hope. Logic says that her sister must be dead. But nevertheless, she decides to retrace Celia’s last steps. Where they’ll lead her, she does not know. Her sister was full of secrets. But Kasey has a secret of her own.
Please Note:
Shit We’ve Read transcripts are created using an online generator with light editing by Laura and Jason. This transcript may not be fully completed or accurate.
LAURA: Shit We’ve Read is brought to you by Oblivion Geeks and partnership with BYLO Network.
JASON: Please visit shitweveread.com to support the show.
LAURA: Now, let’s talk about some books.
[Opening Music]
JASON: Hello, hello and welcome to another episode of Shit We’ve Read, a sci-fi fantasy book podcast hosted by two geeky friends. My name is Jason Rico and I’m joined, as always, by my co-host Laura Benson. Hey Laura. How’s it gone?
LAURA: Hello, hello, hello. It’s going well. How are you?
JASON: I am doing great. Excited to talk about another book.
LAURA: Yeah! This is gonna be fun. I’m very excited to discuss this particular one.
JASON: Yeah. Me, too. I’m sure we have lots to say. In today’s episode, we will be talking about The Ones We’re Meant to Find by Joan He. It is a young adult dystopian science fiction. But before we get into that discussion, this episode we’re recording is a little different than normal. A little peek behind the curtains, usually we pick a book ahead of time that we’re going to be reading and talking about and that’s usually because our reading schedules don’t really sync up very well. Sometimes we read the same books but rarely do we read them at the same time different. Different, you know, speeds that we read and other books that interest us more. But the stars aligned this time we actually read the same book pretty much at the exact same time completely unplanned.
LAURA: Mhmm. Yep.
JASON: So because of that, we decided well let’s jump on a Zoom call and talk about the book. It’s gonna go a little different than normal but here we are anyway.
LAURA: Yeah!
JASON: Now before we dive into our first thoughts, let’s see what the synopsis over on Goodreads has to say.
JASON: One of the most twisty surprising engaging page-turner YAs you’ll read this year—We Were Liars meets Black Mirror, with a dash of Studio Ghibli. Cee has been trapped on an abandoned island for three years without any recollection of how she arrived, or memories from her life prior. All she knows is that somewhere out there, beyond the horizon, she has a sister named Kay, and it’s up to Cee to cross the ocean and find her.
JASON: In a world apart, 16-year-old STEM prodigy Kasey Mizuhara lives in an eco-city built for people who protected the planet―and now needs protecting from it. With natural disasters on the rise due to climate change, eco-cities provide clean air, water, and shelter. Their residents, in exchange, must spend at least a third of their time in stasis pods, conducting business virtually whenever possible to reduce their environmental footprint. While Kasey, an introvert and loner, doesn’t mind the lifestyle, her sister Celia hated it. Popular and lovable, Celia much preferred the outside world. But no one could have predicted that Celia would take a boat out to sea, never to return.
JASON: Now it’s been three years since Celia’s disappearance, and Kasey has given up hope. Logic says that her sister must be dead. But nevertheless, she decides to retrace Celia’s last steps. Where they’ll lead her, she does not know. Her sister was full of secrets. But Kasey has a secret of her own.
LAURA: [laughing] I think you need to reread that last one.
JASON: Why?
LAURA: Because you said three years but it says 3 months. [laughs] And then and then a few other things happened after that.
JASON: [laughing] Nope, it was perfect. We’re going with it. Okay. Alright. Clap. Take two.
[Beep]
[Laura laughs]
JASON: So as always, we’ll give our thoughts on the book without any sort of spoilers. We’ll save those for later. Laura, what did you think about this book? Did you like it?
LAURA: I loved it.
JASON: Yeah?
LAURA: I really did. I went into a not really knowing what this book was going to be about. I pretty much, I think I first fell in love with the cover and then I only read the first paragraph of the synopsis. So I didn’t, I just knew that there were two sisters that were somehow separated and they’re trying to find each other. That’s all that I really knew about it. And so I didn’t really have any expectations of what I was about to read and I was very pleasantly surprised to find that it was actually a sci-fi, which is totally my genre. And I was just very intrigued with jumping between the two sisters and what was happening and trying to piece together the connections. I was very confused in the first half of the book.
JASON: Mhmm.
LAURA: But I, I was confused like in a good way. I was like what is going on? This is so weird. I need to know. So I just kept reading through, kept reading it and then I started getting answers and the twist of this, the plot twist, was kind of surprising to me. [laughs]
JASON: Okay.
LAURA: But looking back at the same time I’m like, I guess that makes sense. I just wasn’t really putting it together.
JASON: I mean, those are the best twists where you don’t always see it coming but looking back you’re like well, the clues are there.
LAURA: Yeah.
JASON: Right? Like I hate books that have a twist and like wait what? How was I supposed to predict that?
LAURA: Yeah. [laughs] But yeah, I really enjoyed this book. It was, surprisingly, I want to say it was kind of a fast read but that might also just be because I was really into it.
JASON: Mhmm.
LAURA: What about you?
JASON: I also really liked it. I really enjoyed it. It’s been a while since a book really, kind of took me on a journey that I wasn’t expecting. You know, most books are pretty straightforward, A to B. I know what I’m going to get. But this book, I was reading, was like, where the heck is this going? What, what is this? What is that? I really liked it. The synopsis that says, it’s, you know, like an episode of Black Mirror is pretty accurate.
LAURA: Mhmm.
JASON: I feel like this definitely could be a Black Mirror episode. If you just take, Cee’s storyline, that felt like a Twilight Zone episode to me.
LAURA: Yeah.
JASON: Because there’s a twist. We’re not going to say what it is. So I can’t really dive into that into that too much but that itself felt like very Twilight Zone, which is more my speed. I haven’t watch all the Black Mirror. I’ve only watched a few episodes. Those episodes give me way too much anxiety.
LAURA: [laughs] They’re terrifying!
JASON: [laughs] So I can’t, I can’t really watch them because you just know something’s gonna happen. I’m like, I don’t need this in my life. I watch TV to escape the pressures and anxiety of the real world. Yeah, but I thought this book was very beautifully written and very atmospheric. It does start very slowly, and honestly, for me it was kind of difficult to get into. I would say the first half of the book took me longer to get through because of that, but eventually does pick up and once the twist comes, it hooks into you and it’s full speed ahead and eventually unravels into really nice mystery. It does leave you- Go ahead.
LAURA: I was just going to say it’s funny that you say that it was a slow read in the beginning for you because when I was looking at other reviews after I finish reading it, there are people that say the same thing but I keep thinking back. Like I don’t think I ever felt like it was slow to me, but it might be that maybe, maybe I was just so into these little references here and there that I was making connections between things that were happening. Maybe it didn’t quite feel that way for me.
JASON: That’s fair. I will admit maybe part of it was because you could tell it was leaving something bigger. And so it was kind of like I need to get through all this first before I can get to that. So some of it felt like it was extra padding that I didn’t need because I just, get me to the mystery already. That said, it was, like I said, it was really nicely, written. Joan He’s a great writer.
LAURA: Mhmm. Yes!
JASON: I’ve heard nothing but, this is the first book I’ve read by her. I’ve heard nothing but good things about the other stuff she’s written. My biggest complaint about the book is that some of the science and the explanations don’t really make sense but the overall story was engaging enough that that didn’t detract from my overall enjoyment.
LAURA: Mhmm.
JASON: Ultimately, this book feels like a science fiction that was written by a great writer who knows how to pull off the fiction part. Not so much the science part.
LAURA: Gotcha. Yeah. No, I can see that. There are a few things that, they’re a little questionable.
JASON: Yeah. You kind of just have to ignore them. It’s like I’m not going to question this too much. Just go with it and it’s a really good book but once you start questioning things and like wait, hold on. [laughs]
LAURA: I think I got- reading it, I just, I got the concept of what they were trying to do and so I was just like, okay, we’ll just go with it.
JASON: Yeah, yeah.
LAURA: So… But you know, this is a young adult too, so we tend to do that reading young adult books in general.
JASON: Right. Anything else you’d like to say before we jump into spoilers?
LAURA: No. I think everything else is probably spoiler.
JASON: Yeah. Okay, let’s do it. You’re warned now. We’re going into spoiler territory. If you haven’t read it and you want to be surprised, stop listening now.
[SPOILER WARNING]
JASON: I always say that the best sci-fi offers some sort of social commentary and this book does a really good job at that. This in particular was like a cautionary tale about where the planet is headed if we don’t do something about climate change and pollution and just like a rampant capitalism. So for me, this was like a really good young adult sci-fi book because you and I have read other young adults sci-fi books in the past. We both agree that the sci-fi part of that was kind of lacking.
LAURA: Mhmm.
JASON: It just, they ended up feeling more like young adult romance with like a little sprinkling of science fiction on top.
LAURA: [laughs] Yeah…
JASON: But this really felt like an actual true sci-fi book and I really, really liked it because of that.
LAURA: Yeah. I, so again, I really only read that first paragraph of the synopsis. So I didn’t make this connection to the, to the story kind of revolving around climate change and just, I guess disaster in general.
JASON: Mhmm.
LAURA: And so, I was actually really excited when I got to the point where I realized this is what this book is about. This is part of it. It’s not a, it’s not just like, you know, we’re just dealing with the effects of this and this is how my life is today. It’s like, no, this is, this is going on. This is part of the story. This is part of the reason for the story. This is a, the story is a result of climate change, let’s say.
JASON: Mhmm.
LAURA: I really loved that it was part of it because we can kind of make that connection. We can definitely make that connection now.
JASON: Right. And it wasn’t heavy-handed either, I felt like.
LAURA: No.
JASON: Like obviously this world exists in a dystopia where pollution has ruined the world but the story never says, you know, this is Earth. [Lowers voice ominously] This is the year 2040 and corporations have polluted our oceans and you know, blah blah blah. [Normal voice] It didn’t really do that. It’s just this is the world that exists in. You can obviously infer that stuff has progressed a certain way so you can make connections to our own lives now but I did enjoy that we were just popped into this world and not really told where it takes place in our future.
LAURA: Well, I just, I thought it was really interesting the whole climate change and like the different solutions that people were trying to come up with to make things better. While they may or may not have worked, they were just fascinating in general and they brought it pretty early on ranks-
JASON: Mhmm.
LAURA: -and I was really fascinated at first with it. I was like that’s kind of a cool idea but then the more I thought about it, I was like actually I don’t know if I like this ranking system. It actually reminded me a lot of one of the Black Mirror episodes. That particular episode is one of the more terrifying ones for me, too. And then, the more I thought about it, I was like, I hope that this is brought up. This rank system is not fair.
JASON: Yeah.
LAURA: And I was happy to see that they did because later on, I made a note for this, let me find it.
[Elevator music and Laura mumbling as she looks for her notes]
LAURA: It was a flashback that Kasey was having where her sister Celia said “With our ranks, we’re invincible.” And I was like, wow, that’s… Okay. So they’re acknowledging this because Kasey specifically says, “Meridian would have called out Celia for her entitlement.” But then it was really interesting at the same time because it continues on, “But wasn’t that what rank was? A measure of what people were entitled to redeem after banking in good planetary stewardship? They were already being taxed for other people’s mistakes. Restricted to living in e-cities, as Celia called them, because others had made the outside territories unsafe.” So it’s kind of an interesting way to look at it, kind of from both sides. It’s like, it’s kind of a gray area but it was still terrifying, the idea of ranks. Especially because they explained that your rank is also based on your ancestors.
JASON: Yeah. That was, that was-
LAURA: So even if you have like a zero-waste lifestyle, you could have a terrible rank because your great-great-great-great grandfather was in the fossil fuel business.
JASON: Right.
LAURA: [laughs] And I was like, I dont- that’s not fair.
JASON: Yeah, it was interesting. Because it’s essentially a caste system.
LAURA: Yeah.
JASON: And on the surface level it kind of makes sense. Like it’s based on merit essentially, right?
LAURA: Mhmm.
JASON: Like how good towards the planet are you? Which, if you’re really good and zero waste and then totally nice and everything, I feel like you should be rewarded. But like you just said, if my great-great-great-grandfather was in fossil fuels, even though I may be perfect, well, guess what? I have a low rank now. Which does play in a lot to actual caste systems of like, how my ancestors were, you know, indentured to the royal family so now I am because of something that happened generations ago.
LAURA: I also don’t think it really made sense- it didn’t really make sense too, because mean, it’s similar to now where somebody is in a situation that’s not good and they’re trying to make it better but you’ve made them stay in that situation, like there’s nothing that they can really do to make it better. So that’s kind of the way that I was looking at it too. All these people that are stuck in these territories on Earth instead of in their e-cities, you know, how much can they really do to make it better?
JASON: Not much because of circumstances.
LAURA: Yeah.
JASON: They just can’t do anything. They’re stuck there. There’s only so much room on these eco cities so, doesn’t matter if you’re perfect on territory four. Like, there’s no room for you. Sorry. It sucks. But that’s what happens in the dystopia, right?
[Both laugh]
LAURA: Yeah, no. It’s true.
JASON: Life sucks. You gotta deal with it.
LAURA: A lot of things are unfair.
JASON: Yeah. Did you foresee the plot twist at all? I know we’re jumping forward a little bit but just to get it out there early.
LAURA: That specific one, no.
JASON: Although, let’s- For anybody who’s listening who maybe hasn’t read the book and they don’t care about spoilers and just want to know. The plot twist is that Cee, the sister that’s stranded on this island that Kay is looking for, Cee’s actually a robot to the original Cee died-
LAURA: Celia.
JASON: Yeah, she died and Kasey, or Kay – they go by Cee and Kay for short – created this robot that had Celia’s memories implanted. And so she thinks she’s the original one.
LAURA: Yeah. She thinks she’s stranded on this island-
JASON: Yeah.
LAURA: -and she’s got some of these memories and so her drive is to find her sister.
JASON: Mhmm. And even that drive is is programmed. It’s not even a real drive. It’s programmed in her to find your sister. So that’s the big twist. So. Sorry, what were you going to say? Did you see it coming?
LAURA: Well, also part of the big twist is that they’re not even in the same time period.
JASON: Correct.
LAURA: So the whole time you’re reading this, going back and forth between each of their perspectives, which is part of the mystery in the beginning with and how, you know, why it was so slow is you find out that Celia, or Cee, has been missing for three months-
JASON: Mhmm.
LAURA: -but then when you’re going to Cee’s perspective, she’s been on this island for three years. So then you’re like, what the heck is going on? So for me, when I was reading through, I kept thinking well maybe she’s in like some kind of different dimension or something because they kept mentioning the island and all these different things were being mentioned between the two. So, you know, you’re making this connection and then there were these little references of like, her, of Cee like really hurting herself or Hero had mentioned to her that the boat that she carried would have been like three tons or something like that. Like how did she carry that? And it was just like really quick little throwaway lines and I was like, this is weird. I don’t know what’s going on. I did kind of start to suspect a little bit towards when they revealed it, that maybe she wasn’t human, but I didn’t necessarily think android or robot, which is- I should have because I mean, U-me was there.
JASON: They introduce robots early on. Yeah.
LAURA: And she had a level of intelligence. So yeah, I was, I was surprised because I knew something was going on. I knew that there was something different about her but I didn’t necessarily connect it to being, her being a robot.
JASON: To be fair though, U-me, which is Cee’s little companion, it’s basically like a Roomba.
LAURA: [laughs] She kind of is.
JASON: It’s like a dictionary, right? So it’s a big leap to make like, well if Roomba‘s exist on this world, then clearly androids exist. It’s like well…
LAURA: Yeah but-
JASON: So it’s fair that you didn’t see that.
LAURA: But at the same time, I mean if you, if you go back and look at some of the scenes, there- Yes, U-me could only say agree or disagree in so many ways.
JASON: Mhmm.
LAURA: She’s programmed to do it that way but at the same time she is still able to do what she’s told. She’s still able to make decisions and like there’s even a scene where, the scene where the rope breaks or something and Cee falls. She wakes up and finds that U-me is like trying to help her. And so like there, there’s some intelligence there but you know, she does kind of act also like a Roomba. [laughs] She was super cute though.
JASON: I love U-me.
LAURA: I was really sorry when Cee was first trying to leave and was like no, stay and I was like [gasps] but it-but U-me! You’re leaving her behind?! [laughs]
JASON: She’s basically like a little puppy. She just follows her around everywhere.
LAURA: I felt, I felt like hit in the feels when Cee realized in the end, towards the end of the book that U-me let Hero take her new boat that she, or raft.
JASON: Mhmm.
LAURA: She was like, oh, you let him do this. You want me to stay. And she said strongly agree and I was like, Oh! U-me, you’re so cute!
[Both laugh]
JASON: She’s adorable. Yeah, I did suspect something was up because the chapters do bounce back and forth between Cee’s story and Kay’s story and right away I knew something was up. I didn’t suspect that she was an android. The ideas that popped in my mind were maybe she’s a clone. Maybe this island that she’s on is being observed, like it’s like a giant dome or something.
LAURA: Mmm!
JASON: Like it’s part of an experiment. There’s definitely something out of the ordinary and then later as the chapters progresses, it was like I feel like these stories aren’t lining up quite the way we’re being told they are. So when it was revealed that the timelines were different like, oh, that makes sense.
LAURA: Mhmm.
JASON: Okay, I see that now. Yeah, but I think He, the author, did a really good job at peppering in all these little mysteries that just added to the sense of what is going on, right?
LAURA: Mhmm.
JASON: Because Cee was colorblind on the island. Why is Cee colorblind on the island? She has no memory of it. She just doesn’t see color. That’s just one of the things. So that’s like a little mystery that you ask yourself why is she colorblind? And then later on, it’s revealed that it’s part of the programming-
LAURA: Mhmm.
JASON: -which again, I don’t think it really make sense because if you look the science, it does really make sense. But ignoring that, it’s just another little mystery that adds depth to the overall mystery that really made it enjoyable and engaging.
LAURA: One thing that I found- I found Kasey’s character somewhat fascinating.
JASON: Yeah.
LAURA: She’s very logical. Very sciencey… Complete opposite from Celia and I found myself kind of connecting to her sometimes. I don’t want to say that I’m as quite reserved and, I guess her terms would probably be like unfeeling, or you know, something to that effect, but there’s times when I feel like I’m not as close or I don’t feel as emotional about certain things. So it was kind of interesting to find myself connecting with a character like that. But I found it interesting how that kind of played into her overall story arc in this because she is very much about, you know, finding her sister and you know, we find out, obviously the state of the world is because of climate change and how people are treating it and not taking care of it, and then Kasey also uses that to blame humanity on Celia being poisoned and eventually dying. Do you think that that kind of made her into kind of a villain of the story for a short time? The way that she reacted to this knowledge?
JASON: Maybe? It’s weird because the book doesn’t really have a really identifiable antagonist. Like there’s no like overarching villain. Like, Hero kind of is one for Cee but it’s really more… Ugh. I hate, I hate that I’m going to say this.
[Laura laughs]
JASON: It reminds me of Frozen a little bit in that my biggest complaint with Frozen sometimes is that there’s no real antagonist. It’s this, it’s a story of the two sisters and any sort of bad guy is minor and off to the side.
LAURA: Hmm.
JASON: And so this story’s very similar. That’s the story of these two sisters but there isn’t really a bad guy, which is not necessarily a bad thing. You don’t always need a bad guy. I’m just Disney animation nerd and like my Cruella De Vil‘s and Captain Hook’s and stuff. But I definitely think Kasey had very villainy tendencies.
LAURA: Mhmm.
JASON: In a different story told differently, she’d be like the Lex Luthor, kind of thing, you know?
LAURA: That’s kind of feel what I was thinking.
JASON: Like it’s the way the story is told. No one is the villain of their own story.
LAURA: Mhmm.
JASON: But if the story was coming from Meridian’s point of view or, what’s his name, Actinium’s point of view, she could easily be written as a villain. What I really liked about Kasey in comparison to Celia is Celia we find out, Cee that we’ve, you know, grown attached to this entire time is a robot, but Kasey’s really more the robot.
LAURA: Mhmm!
JASON: She’s the one that’s very emotionless and just all logic. Cee’s very emotional and finds beauty in everything and you know, likes the quiet moments and very poetic. I thought that was really interesting, that Kasey’s the human that’s a robot and Cee’s a robot that’s a human.
[Laura laughs]
JASON: It kind of blew my mind a little bit. [laughs]
LAURA: This is very well written.
JASON: Yeah.
LAURA: And I think, you know, and I’ve mentioned before, I love AI, robot stories.
JASON: Yeah.
LAURA: The kind that question what makes one, what makes someone human and so this is absolutely one hundred percent part of that debate.
JASON: Mhmm.
LAURA: And I think that it was, it was very amazing that the robots were the ones that were just very human had all these emotions and were just like trying to help each other and all that stuff and so you’re right. It was a very, very interesting way to have them written.
JASON: Yeah. Even Hero, who was programmed to stop Cee. So he’s kind of a villain. He was very caring and loving and nurturing and very, very interesting way of writing the robots. I did have a question. You know, really relates to is Kasey a villain. Early on in the story, we find out that the girls mother has died. She passed away prior to the story beginning.
LAURA: Mhmm.
JASON: And then we find out a little bit about this system that people have is like this implant thing that is like an interface that connects your brain. I forgot what it’s called, but it gives you stats and lets you see information but it also monitors your vitals and your own stats, your medical stuff and so it knows when you are feeling, you know, depressed. It knows when your chemical levels are out of whack and it can adjust for that. It can like raised like serotonin and stuff like that.
LAURA: Keep your chemicals in line.
JASON: Yeah, keep you balanced and stuff like that. So then the story, Celia is sad because their mom has died. Kasey, being the robot the she is-
[Both chuckle]
JASON: -doesn’t really feel much. Like she knows she should be sad but she doesn’t really feel sad but she sees her sister hurting and so she like hacks into Celia’s system and manually adjusts her chemical levels so that she can feel better.
LAURA: Mhmm.
JASON: Do you think that Kay was wrong to have done that for Cee? Or is that just a case of her being a good sister?
LAURA: At this point, they’re still children, right?
JASON: They’re younger, yeah.
LAURA: Yeah. I feel like-
JASON: And again, to make it clear, in this book Kay is a STEM prodigy. Like she’s a prodigy when it comes to technology and robotics and computers over that. So she’s capable of hacking and doing all the stuff where normally you shouldn’t be able to. But yes, you’re correct. They are still young.
LAURA: Yeah. And she is also the younger sister.
JASON: Mhmm.
LAURA: I think, I think as children it was probably more of I’m just trying to take care of my sister. I don’t want her to hurt. But I think technically she shouldn’t have done it. I mean, that’s messing around with somebody’s biology without there, without their say. Even if it is just adjusting a few chemical levels to help balance out her mood, it’s still deciding to do something with her sister’s body and, in a way, it’s manipulation. So, I don’t, I really don’t think that she should have done it but I also, considering that they are children, and I think, I think Kasey was fairly young when this happened, she probably just didn’t really understand why that wasn’t okay. Whether she is [laughs] an unemotional robot or not, she probably just didn’t understand from her being so young.
JASON: Hm. That’s fair. There were a couple moments where we’re told that Kasey does certain things not really understanding why it’s wrong. Like she knows that it’s wrong because she’s told, but she doesn’t feel the wrongness of it. Like the example I’m thinking of is, again after her mom died, Kasey wanted to bring back those memories. Right?
LAURA: Mhmm.
JASON: Like didn’t she try getting those memories and she wanted to like implant them into a robot. So she can basically have her mom back and it got her in big trouble, you know, like real, real bad. She was like essentially a felon, I think.
LAURA: Yeah. Yeah.
JASON: And so it was a big, it was a big deal. You’re not supposed to do that. You’re not supposed to mess with people’s memories when it comes to robotics. But again, at the time, it was like, she said like I know it’s- she tells us that she knows it’s wrong but she doesn’t really feel the wrongness of it.
LAURA: Mhmm.
JASON: If she can do this and bring back her mom and bring back the mom for specially for a sister than why is it wrong.
LAURA: Yeah. She definitely gotten a lot of trouble for that one.
JASON: Yeah, I love, I love that the sisters, they both felt broken for totally different reasons.
LAURA: Mhmm.
JASON: Kay felt broken because she didn’t have, she didn’t feel the way she was supposed to feel about things. And she was aware of that. Like other people are sad. I’m not feeling sad. Other people are upset. I’m not feeling upset. Constantly throughout the book, she understand that she doesn’t feel the same way people are supposed to feel. And then Cee on the flip side, thinks she’s broken because she’s too sensitive and she wishes she could be strong like Kay. Kay takes things very in stride because she doesn’t feel things. So both sisters felt like they were broken for the exact reasons that the other sisters thought they were strong. Does that make sense?
LAURA: Mhmm.
JASON: And I love that because-
LAURA: But really they’re stronger together.
JASON: Absolutely. Yes. They were, I think they were great sisters. They were written so well together and I truly believe that these sisters got along and just made for a good pair.
LAURA: Mhmm. It would have been nice to see some more memories of them together.
JASON: Yeah.
LAURA: But the memories we did get of them together, it showed that balance. It showed, you know, like Celia trying to get Kasey to basically experience life a little bit. Sadly, it did eventually lead to-
[both start chuckling]
JASON: Yeah. Yeah.
LAURA: -to her death but at the same time, you know, Celia was just like, let’s go see the ocean. Let’s just see it. Actually see it in person and, you know, just trying to experience something that’s not something they do every day.
JASON: Yeah. We all, we all need people to pull us out of our comfort zones, you know, especially those of us who exist more in our head. So it’s nice to have someone to say hey let’s go down and check out the beach. Just maybe not the beach is toxic.
LAURA: [laughs] Yeah…
JASON: But you know, what you gonna do? Like that’s the only beach you got so… YOLO.
[Both laugh]
LAURA: Well stuff happens, I guess. Well, sticking with the whole AI programming thing.
JASON: Yeah.
LAURA: So in relation to Project Reset, which for anyone who may not have read this but wants to know, project- or Operation Reset was Kasey’s plan to have pretty much every single person in the world go into… cryostasis?
JASON: Mhmm.
LAURA: In the ocean-
JASON: Yeah.
LAURA: -for around a thousand years-
JASON: A thousand years. Yeah. [laughs] I thought that was ridiculous but…
LAURA: Around a thousand years to allow Earth to heal on its own.
JASON: Yeah. Because Earth is experiencing constant like earthquakes and stuff because of all the damage to it. Like it’s not stable.
LAURA: Yeah, they’re losing-
JASON: So they’re going to reach some sort of apocalyptic event at some point and so to save humanity, people, like the brightest minds in the world are trying to think of ways to do that. So Kasey has this plan.
LAURA: So there are a number of things that are, that happen that are related to this. I’m going to stick with the AI thing first.
JASON: [laughs] Okay. I have a lot of questions after that.
LAURA: [laughs] I know. I know. But since we’re already talking about robots and stuff.
JASON: Sure.
LAURA: So we find out that having this robot, Cee, or I guess technically C-model. I don’t know if we ever found if she had more numbers or not. Cee was created as part of this Operation Reset. So, after so many years, like these robots are supposed to be released one at a time to meet certain-to do certain tasks and see if Earth is healed enough for humanity to come back.
JASON: Cee’s basically Eva. From uh-
LAURA: Yes!
JASON: Or EVE from WALL-E. Right?
LAURA: Yes. But-
JASON: Go out there. See if there’s plants.
[both laugh]
LAURA: Yes. Pretty much. That’s a good comparison.
JASON: [mimics WALL-E] Eeeeva.
[both continue laughing]
LAURA: So… But part of-
JASON: Wait, wait. Cee’s Eva. Does that make Hero WALL-E?
LAURA: I guess so.
JASON: And then does that make like U-me like MO or something?
LAURA: Aw, MO.
JASON: [mimics Mo] Mo mo mo mo mo mo mo.
[both laugh]
LAURA: He’s one of my favorites.
JASON: Yeah. Okay, sorry. Go ahead.
LAURA: So Cee obviously was programmed to basically be Kasey’s sister Celia. So she’s programmed with these memories that over time come back and she has this drive to find her sister and this drive to survive and whatnot and it’s supposed to be like if she reaches a certain point, Cee, if Cee reaches a certain point of happiness and whatnot, that will trigger the drive to find Kasey down in the ocean.
JASON: Mhmm.
LAURA: Did you, do you think programming Cee to be so human was actually necessary?
JASON: No. That made no sense to me whatsoever. All of Operation Reset made no sense to me whatsoever. Like okay, going into cryostasis for a thousand years? Okay, fine. Fair enough. I get it. You want to be asleep while the Earth fixes itself and then when it’s, you know, in a good place, you wake up. Okay, that’s fine. But the whole like sending out these C-models to live and reach a certain level of happiness and then once they do that, then you have to search out the person that you’re programmed to love and wake them up. It felt so convoluted and overly complicated for no reason. Like why do you need to reach a certain level of happiness? What’s the point of that?
LAURA: Is it-
JASON: I mean, I guess-
LAURA: Is it supposed to simulate real human life?
JASON: I guess so. Like, okay. Like if you can find happiness and Earth has everything you need to have a fulfilled life, so now humans can do the same but you’re living by yourself. Like, how’s the air? Okay. How’s the water? Is it toxic? Is it breathable air? Is there, is there animals? Are there plant life? Okay. Do we have everything that is, that makes Earth habitable for humans? We do? Perfect. Wake everybody up because they can work together to be happy. If I’m by myself, I’m not going to really be happy but if I have my friends and my family, then I’ll probably be happy.
LAURA: Well, she had Hero.
JASON: Who wanted to kill her!
LAURA: Only sometimes! [laughs]
JASON: Okay, again. That doesn’t make sense either. Why only sometimes?
LAURA: That was another question I did have about that.
JASON: Yeah, me too. Hero was programmed to stop Cee from waking up Kay but only when I feel like it.
[both laugh]
LAURA: I honestly, this is kind of off topic, but I feel like he only did things when it seemed like he needed to do something to stop her in her tracks. I don’t think she was necess- I don’t think he was programmed to just straight up kill her. I think he was programmed to just stop her from finding Kay. So if he just found a way to make her happy and not look for Kay, he probably never would have tried to kill her again.
JASON: Nope. I don’t buy it because… Okay, she’s making a boat. She’s about to leave the island. Okay. Destroy the boat. Makes sense. Don’t let her leave the island. Fair enough. But she’s taking all these steps prior to building a boat.
LAURA: True.
JASON: Prior to building a raft and he just randomly decides I’m going to cut the rope of this time so she possibly dies but any of the other times, he didn’t try stopping her. Like, he’d help her with things. Like they’re getting wood for the raft. He’s actively helping her find materials to build a raft.
LAURA: Maybe Actinium just doesn’t know how to program robots very well. [laughs]
JASON: That might be it. That might be it. It’s, it was a user error.
LAURA: But I mean, it could be, you know, I think, at one point, I made a note about this too, Cee was basically comparing like her purpose, her own purpose was fueled by her memories, whereas Hero’s purpose didn’t require memories and she even says “even a personality.” So he’s basically like a blank slate learning how to be a person.
JASON: He’s a Terminator.
LAURA: [laughs] But he doesn’t, but he doesn’t know that he’s trying to kill her until them one time.
JASON: Mhmm.
LAURA: So I don’t know. Maybe it’s, maybe it is a lack of… I don’t know. [laughs]
JASON: See, this is what I’m talking about. When you look at the science a little bit, it doesn’t quite make sense.
LAURA: Yeah, you right.
JASON: But if you just take it at it’s face value than okay. It’s fine. Good story.
LAURA: Okay
JASON: Okay. Again, going back to Operation Reset. Cee was programmed to find Kay. Kay is the one that needs to wake everybody else up. Right?
LAURA: Yes.
JASON: What happens if Kay’s pod is damaged? Nothing. Kay, Cee can’t wake up Kay. Cee can’t wake up anybody else.
LAURA: Yeah. Well I think that is what was happening in the end, right? After she pushed her back into her pod?
JASON: Right. Cee flips out because she finds out she’s a robot and tries to kill Kay.
LAURA: Basically, nobody will ever wake up again. [laughs]
JASON: Yeah! That’s, that’s not a great plan. You need to work up- wake up this one person first.
LAURA: Unless we misunderstood. I don’t know.
JASON: There’s no backup plan. How about just like just hit the wake up everybody button? Is that, is that not an option? Like it was so complicated for no reason. Or have like, have like a council like a set of 10 people you need to wake up. Kay’s first. Oh, Kay’s unavailable? Fine. I’m gonna go wake up this person. They’re unavailable? Fine. I’m gonna wake up this person. Like if you want to have a group of people who are selected to truly deem if humanity’s ready to come back and not trust in AI, then okay. I’ll buy that. But give me more than just one person.
LAURA: Yeah. But I think this also might connect back to did Kasey become the villain of the story because remember at one point, her plan was originally that her and Actinium were going to decide who was going to wake up and who wasn’t.
JASON: Correct. Yeah.
LAURA: So I mean, I don’t, I don’t know. Obviously there was a, like a six year time jump so maybe there is something in the plan that still allowed her to decide if I’m not going to be here then no one is. I don’t know. [laughs]
JASON: I don’t know. Kay is a narcissist.
[both laugh]
JASON: Look, she’s very just like, into herself and she thinks- she has delusions of grandeur. Kind of like I’m the most important person to this plan. For no reason.
LAURA: So Lex Luthor.
JASON: Huh?
LAURA: So Lex Luthor.
JASON: Yeah, exactly! She’s Lex Luthor!
LAURA: She’s trying to save the planet but at the same time she’s kind of a villain about it.
JASON: She’s Elon Musk.
[Laura laughs]
JASON: Right? Like if Elon Musk existed in this world, he would be Kay. I hundred percent believe that.
LAURA: [still laughing] I guess I could see that.
JASON: And there’s a good chance he’ll never listen to this podcast so I’m not afraid to say that. [laughs]
LAURA: I feel like, I mean, he’s not too far. Isn’t he working on artificial intelligence?
JASON: Maybe?
LAURA: I believe he is because I think my husband was going into detail about how Elon Musk is terrified of AI Terminator type stuff and so he’s decided he’s going to make it so that he can control it? I don’t know.
JASON: Wait. Elon is scared of Terminators existing. Like bad AI existing so he wants to create AI first to make sure it’s good?
LAURA: I guess.
JASON: Okay. We’ve all seen this movie before.
[Laura laughs]
JASON: He is really gonna create the bad AI. Like if we’ve learned anything from our history of AI, it’s that AI’s will turn evil. Look at all the artificial intelligent, the bots on Twitter. They like instantly turn racist.
LAURA: Oh yeah. Because they learn from all of the other people there.
JASON: Yeah. Exactly. So if they go racist in one week, they’re instantly going to turn murderers within a year. Great job, Elon.
LAURA: I feel like we should just not make it if we want to avoid it. [laughs]
JASON: No, no.
LAURA: Anyways.
JASON: Well okay. I want to go back to the Operation Rest because I have another question.
LAURA: Okay.
JASON: Maybe it was explained and I just forgot. How did Kay get into, whatever, the pods, the cryostasis area that- Sorry, sorry. How did Cee, when she was programmed to revive Kay, how did she get into there?
LAURA: There was… I thought there was like some… door thing.
JASON: Yes. There’s a door. There’s some kind of entrance but I’m saying like-
LAURA: I have my book. [laughs]
JASON: Okay. Okay, my question. Why didn’t- why wasn’t Hero just programmed to go there and destroy the pods, is what I’m saying.
LAURA: That’s a good question.
JASON: That’s what I’m saying like what was keeping-
LAURA: He wasn’t programmed because we needed a book.
JASON: Oh.
[both laugh]
JASON: Because he was like, yeah, this book’s gonna be a lot shorter if that’s what happens so I’m not going to do that.
LAURA: Maybe she was trying to explain how AI could be a human.
JASON: Laura, I feel like I, at least I, we, but at least I, have a tendency of saying we really like books and then just finding all the holes in them. [laughs]
LAURA: Okay. It’s funny-
JASON: [laughing] We said the same thing for Renegades. We really liked Renegades but you know, now that I think about it…
[Listen to Episode 01: Renegades Trilogy]
LAURA: No I, but I love this book. I really love this book. [laughs]
JASON: No, same! I do too! I do too! I love this book and I hundred percent recommend it. Like, seriously, if you haven’t read it, read it. It’s really beautiful. It’s slow but once it gets going, it’s like full speed ahead. It’s a roller coaster ride. It’s great. Just don’t question things.
LAURA: Well, I mean, I think every book has something about it that you’re like, what the fuck.
JASON: Yeah. Yeah.
LAURA: So I think that’s pretty normal but-
JASON: I mean, it’s like Star Wars. Like Star Wars is great but there’s things in it that don’t make sense.
LAURA: Yeah. There’s a lot of things in there.
JASON: Just, why is that arm furry but the guy looked human? Don’t question it just move forward.
LAURA: Just, just, yeah. Just forget that part. [laughs]
JASON: Yeah. What? You mean they’re brother and sister but they totally made out. Don’t-Ssh! No, they didn’t! Just move on.
LAURA: So my movie nights with my cousin every week, I told him the other night… I was like I need to stop watching movies with you because always do is poke holes in these movies [laughing] and I question what’s going on now?
JASON: Just watch better movies with no holes. Problem solved.
LAURA: Well, it was, it was really happening during the Pirates of the Caribbean movies. We have with the fourth one next.
JASON: Oh. Actually me and my movie group, we went through those earlier this year too. All of them.
LAURA: Yeah?
JASON: And they get more questionable as they go on, for sure.
LAURA: Well there’s a lot of technical questions that we keep asking too. And we’re like, wait, but if this happened, does it mean this happens and we’re like, huh…
JASON: Sssshhhhhhh… Just-
LAURA: That should- You’re right. That should be happening, but it’s not.
[both laugh]
LAURA: Okay. I’m looking at my book here, though.
JASON: Okay. While you do that, I have another question about Operation Reset? [laughs]
LAURA: Okay.
JASON: That plan was so human centric because it was about saving humanity. But what about all the animals? What about all the plant life? Was their plan basically to wake up in a thousand years and be like, whatever the earth looks like, whatever animals we have, whatever plant life we have, that’s what we have? We’re not going to try to save life as we know it? Just us? Like it felt like humans were the cancer but the plan was save the cancer. Let the body die. But the cancer will be around still. I don’t know.
LAURA: Yeah. They didn’t really talk about animals at all. Did they?
JASON: No.
LAURA: The only thing that I think that they reference for like upkeep or anything was when Kasey was talking to… Was it Leona on the island?
JASON: Mhmm.
JASON: She was like, are you sure you don’t want a bot, like a maintenance bots or something. A clean up bot to take care of your house and she was like, no, I’m fine. So it sounds like some people may have had the option to at least have these robots taking care of their properties for a thousand years.
JASON: That’s true. No, you’re right. That is true. They did. Robots will still exist and like try to keep things.
LAURA: Yeah. Because they were like we’ll just, you know, we’ll do what we have to when we come back.
JASON: Okay. That makes sense.
LAURA: But that still doesn’t really necessarily address like animals-
JASON: For a thousand years old. That’s a long time.
LAURA: -and flora and stuff. A thousand years. Like yeah, it does not take, that like, you’re going to have no more buildings left.
JASON: No. You’d need so many robots and by the time you came out of cryostasis, the world would be just covered in robots that would have gained sentience and become Terminators and kill all humans. That’s a sequel.
LAURA: [laughs] Okay, I think I found it.
JASON: Okay.
LAURA: “Memory fades as I reach the bottom of the sea.” She talks about the bottom of the ocean. “Something sparkles in the distance. A house-size dome emerging from the sand. It’s silver like the lid to a fancy dish. It lifts like a lid too when I reach it. I swim in without a second thought and it sucks me down, dumps me seawater and all onto some slick, cold surface.” So, I guess it’s like a suction tube?
JASON: So did, it doesn’t explicitly say like, it scanned me?
LAURA: No.
JASON: It doesn’t indicate there’s any sort of security system.
LAURA: It says “it lifts like a lid when I reach it. I swim in and it sucks me down and dumps me” basically inside.
JASON: Yeah. Hero should’ve just gone on there.
LAURA: I don’t know. Maybe there is a system though. Maybe it did automatically open to her because it’s her.
JASON: Maybe. Maybe.
LAURA: I don’t know.
JASON: I would have liked to have been told that so I didn’t question things.
LAURA: She wouldn’t really know. Maybe the- I don’t know…
JASON: You could easily be like I approach and weird red light scans over my body. I don’t know what it means but I continued on for-
[Laura laughs]
JASON: -we would be like oh, it probably scanned you for like genetic-
LAURA: Oh. It was seeing if it was her. It’s okay.
JASON: [sighs]
LAURA: I’m fine with it. [laughs]
JASON: Can we talk about the food in this book? Because it’s like…
LAURA: [laughs] The taro?
JASON: Huh?
LAURA: The taro?
JASON: No, no. I’m talking about, like, back in the eco-city. The food that they eat. Like there’s- I saved the quote. It says, “‘I heard they applied to eco-city 7 but got rejected,’ Meridian says as the fourth period bell rang. Classroom doors opening and discharging students into the hall. They joined the tide of flesh students coursing to the cafeteria. ‘Makes you wonder how they got admitted to ours,’ Meridian mutters as they picked up their protein cubes. Then while getting their nutritional IV poles bet their plans. ‘What?’ she asked as Kasey motion to her to lower her voice. Synths. It was the proper term for people who’d undergone genetic modification to synthesize their own glucose from carbon and water. They processed twice as efficient as intravenous nutrient delivery.” So they’re just eating proteins cubes and and IV?
LAURA: They don’t eat food! Aaawww…
JASON: What? This is no way to live.
LAURA: [laughs] I’m mean they’re trying to have like zero waste and stuff. Like they probably don’t have a whole lot of land or anything.
JASON: Okay. But this, the second part where it says “the synths who’ve gone under genetic modification to synthesize their own glucose from carbon and water.” That’s cool.
[both laugh]
JASON: I like that. I just read that. I was like aw, these poor people. They’re just…
LAURA: It sounds pretty boring though. But I mean it sounds boring only eating taro on the island too.
JASON: Yeah, I don’t know what’s worse.
LAURA: Although the description of the mashed taro, like mashed potatoes, made me really start to crave mashed potatoes.
JASON: Yeah, that was pretty good.
LAURA: Maybe we should hang out soon and make mashed potatoes.
JASON: I’ve never eaten taro as a food dish.
LAURA: I haven’t either.
JASON: I’ve only ever had it has like a drink. Actually, I take that back. There was one time I ordered, I think Chinese food and it had taro in it. It was interesting. But yeah, mashed potatoes sound good?
LAURA: Yeah.
JASON: I wonder if there’s different flavored protein cubes-
LAURA: I hope so.
JASON: Or is it just generic protein cube?
LAURA: I hope there are flavors. That’s a good question. [laughs]
JASON: All right. Anything else [laughs] we missed about this book?
LAURA: [laughs] Um… There was something else. I’m trying to remember.
[elevator music with Laura mumbling about scanning over her notes]
LAURA: I kind of wish we had gotten a more definitive ending rather than so open-ended
JASON: Remind me how it ends again? It’s just, it just Cee goes back to waking Kay, right?
LAURA: Yeah.
JASON: And then it ends. Yeah.
LAURA: But that was intentional. She’s posted, the author has posted saying this was never intended to be more than one book. This is how it is. Like that’s fine. That’s fine. I was just like, I kind of wanted more. Like I wanted to know what was going to happen with Hero. I wanted to know like did Actinium… Did he just stay? Did he not go into stasis? Did he go into stasis? Is he going to still be here then? Is that going to be a problem? Because he was a murderer. [laughs] So I was, I was hoping to get some more answers but I think I’m fine as long as, obviously, we know that she did end up going down there too. To let Kasey out.
JASON: Yeah. The book is the story about the sisters. Like that’s what it’s about. It’s these two sisters understanding each other, finding each other, doing everything they can to find each other. So it makes sense that the book would end there because they found each other and I know we are, you know, poking all these holes into the science but ultimately the science isn’t the focus either. It’s about the sisters and the characters and…
LAURA: Yeah.
JASON: So I like, I like how it ended. You’re right. The curious side of me wanted to read more about what the world would be like but that is an entirely different story and I was satisfied overall.
LAURA: Yeah, No, I loved it. I feel like it was very well balanced overall. Like, we got we got that character development. It’s very character driven between the two sisters and the to two guys, too. I got my science fiction from it. On top of that, I got my AI. [laughs]
JASON: Mhmm.
LAURA: And the whole climate change thing. You know, that’s very relevant to today and, you know, something that has been very important to me and like, the last year trying to, you know, make changes in our own household to, you know, take better care of our planet. So it’s kind of interesting to see that so part of the story. But it didn’t really feel like it was more one than the other. It felt like I was getting everything together and in a very balanced story.
JASON: And most important, we got robot sex.
[Both laughing]
JASON: Which you didn’t know at the time-
LAURA: [continues laughing] You’re right.
JASON: -but looking back now…
LAURA: I mean it wasn’t explicit but yes.
[Both continue laughing]
LAURA: You’re right. We didn’t know at the time but that is what it was.
JASON: All right. What would you rate this out of five?
LAURA: Wait, wait, wait!
JASON: Oh. Wait. What?
LAURA: Was it? It did happen before, right? Or did it happen after?
JASON: I thought it happened before they were aware- Oh actually, I don’t know anymore.
LAURA: No! It happened after!
JASON: It happened after?
LAURA: It happened after! My notes say so.
JASON: All right.
LAURA: Because it, because my notes are saying that it happens a couple pages after Cee was comparing her need for Celia’s memories to Hero not needing memories.
JASON: Hmm.
LAURA: So we did get robots sex.
JASON: All right!
[both laugh]
LAURA: That was really, that was actually really cute though. Because he was, he was still like, are you okay? Is this okay?
JASON: Yeah, yeah.
LAURA: Do we need protection? [laughs]
JASON: [chuckles] Yeah.
LAURA: I laughed. I was like, oh, so cute. There’s only two of you in the world right now and you’re asking that.
JASON: Yeah.
LAURA: That’s so cute of you.
JASON: It is. Yeah. For somebody who is not programmed with a personality, he’s very caring and nurturing.
LAURA: He is. I’m wondering how much of that actually came from Actinium.
JASON: Hmm.
LAURA: Because he was himself caring to certain point.
JASON: He probably used himself as a base, blueprint or something.
LAURA: That’s where the murderous-
JASON: Exactly.
LAURA: -bouts come from. Is from when he was killing people in the end.
JASON: Yeah, makes sense.
[both laugh]
LAURA: Okay. Sorry. What, what were you asking me earlier?
JASON: What would you rate it?
LAURA: Oh I, I honestly rated a 5.
JASON: You gave it a 5?
LAURA: I did. It’s totally my kind of book. I loved it.
JASON: I was going back and forth. I kind of wanted to give it a 5 because like I said, once it got its hooks into me, like, I devoured and I loved it. But I had all these questions about the science that it felt like lacking so its like, maybe 4 or 4.5. That’s probably what I’d give it. If it’s stuffed that had been explained just a little bit more, then it’d be 5 for me. And also it started a little slow but…
LAURA: Gotcha. Hey, that’s still a pretty good score though.
JASON: Solid book all in all.
LAURA: Yeah!
JASON: On Goodreads, it has an average score of 3.91 out of 1,842 ratings, which honestly is lower than I thought.
LAURA: Yeah!
JASON: I’ve heard a lot of good things about this book and I felt like it’d be one of those books that would be trending around the 4.15 area, 4.2, but I think you mentioned earlier, a lot of reviews are saying it starts slow and I think that’s hurting it. I’m sure people are not finishing it because of that, maybe.
LAURA: Maybe.
JASON: But it’s a shame because I think it’s a really a book. It’s a solid book for sure.
LAURA: Yeah. I loved it for sure.
JASON: Yeah. I definitely would recommend this.
LAURA: Yeah. So anyone who likes YA, sisters-
JASON: Mhmm.
LAURA: This is, this is pretty good. If you like sci-fi, this is probably, it might be a good intro to sci-fi.
JASON: I think it’s, I think it’s a good-
LAURA: Because it’s not too heavy.
JASON: No, no. Like if you’re into hard sci-fi, it’s not going to do it for you. But if you like sci-fi in general, I think, I think you’ll like it. It has a lot in it. It has robots and AI and a lot of- it doesn’t mention a lot of different technology and stuff like that.
LAURA: Mhmm.
JASON: I think it, the world building around the technology and the sci-fi is there for sure. It’s just not always explained as much as maybe we’d like, but that’s fine.
LAURA: Yeah.
JASON: I did say early on in the episode that this is going to be a little different because this was kind of a spontaneous episode. Normally we try to think of some recommendations that we’d want to give to people who like this book. That said, Laura, I’m still going to put you on the spot a little bit-
[Laura laughs]
JASON: -and ask do you happen to have any recommendations that’s come to mind?
LAURA: The first one that comes to mind for me has to do with androids. Surprise!
JASON: Whaaaaat?
LAURA: Oh, what? [laughs]
JASON: Not on-brand for Laura at all.
LAURA: I would say, if you want to read like a classic, android type book, Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep, aka Blade Runner by Philip K. Dick is probably a good book to start with. If you haven’t seen the movie, it’s basically about androids just wanting to be human. So it’s more of a cyberpunk dystopian sci-fi, but it is pretty, it’s a pretty good book. So maybe read the book and then watch the movie or vice versa.
JASON: But which version of the movie? That’s the question.
LAURA: Ugh… Let’s not get into that. [laughs]
JASON: Because there’s like five versions. People need to know which version. The theatrical? The director’s. The final cut?
LAURA: Let’s go with director’s.
JASON: The Snyder cut?
LAURA: What? No!
JASON: I’m sure he has a cut. He has a cut of everything now.
LAURA: He probably does. I don’t know. Maybe I would, I can’t remember which one we ended up watching for my film class. I want to say the director’s. The director’s cut.
JASON: I couldn’t, I couldn’t tell you which is the definitive, quote-unquote definitive cut.
LAURA: I just know one of them was like apparently really long.
JASON: Yeah.
LAURA: But I want to say the director’s cut because I think the director’s cut had more stuff in it that helped make things make a little more sense. Like the… Oh, I don’t want to do any spoilers.
[both laugh]
JASON: Alright. Moving on.
LAURA: But really, any of those. Any of the cuts of Blade Runner I would say are pretty good.
JASON: Yeah. Or just skip to the sequel. The sequel is great.
[both laugh]
LAURA: I don’t know.
JASON: There’s only one cut of that one.
LAURA: You don’t have enough context if you do that because that is a continuation.
JASON: Yeah, that’s fair. That’s fair. Okay. Any other recommendations?
LAURA: That’s the only one I can think of off the top of my head. What about you?
JASON: To, I guess, piggyback off of your classic sci-fi recommendation, if we’re going to talk about robots and AI, I’m gonna go classic old-school. I, Robot by Isaac Asimov. It’s a collection of short stories all dealing with robots and the three laws of robotics. The movie I, Robot featuring Will Smith was based on this. The movie Bicentennial Man featuring Robin Williams is based on one of the short stories. I would definitely check it out. It’s really good. I’ve read it before and I love it. I’m actually planning on reading it again very soon. And then for fans of YA, I would recommend The Sound of Stars by Alicia Dow. You and I read that together not too long ago.
LAURA: Mhmm.
JASON: It’s another YA dystopian sci-fi except that the planet isn’t dying because of pollution. It has been invaded by aliens.
[Laura laughs]
JASON: So it’s more of an alien dystopian. But YA romance-
LAURA: Yeah. That one, yeah. Sound of Stars definitely leans a little more romance.
JASON: Yeah. But if you like your YA sci-fi, it’s another one worth checking out.
LAURA: Yeah. I agree.
JASON: And that’s all I got.
LAURA: Heeeey!
JASON: We did it.
LAURA: Yay!
JASON: We read the book and then we talked about the book.
LAURA: We should do this more often.
JASON: We should. Let’s read another book. Laura, I’m just going to say, if one day it’s revealed that you were an android this entire time, I won’t be surprised.
[Laura laughs]
JASON: Not because your robotic. Just because you really like AI and android stuff a lot. Be like, you know, it makes sense now.
[both laugh]
LAURA: I want to read books about my own people?
JASON: Yeah.
[both continue laughing]
LAURA: I mean, you never know. I mean, sometimes people don’t know. Even Loki questioned himself.
JASON: Oh, Loki. Oh, if you haven’t watch Loki on Disney+, watch it. At the time we’re recording this, the first episode just released two days ago.
LAURA: And by the time this is released, you probably should have already watched it.
JASON: Yeah.
LAURA: So that won’t be a spoiler. [laughs]
JASON: Oh, that’s true. [laughs] All right. I think that wraps up this episode, unless there’s anything else you want to add Laura?
LAURA: No, I think that covered everything.
JASON: Cool, cool. As always, if you’ve read this book, feel free to comment on our socials and let us know what you thought of it. Laura, do you want to let the good people know where they can find your personal stuff?
LAURA: Sure! I am on Instagram and Twitter @aka_ellebee. Though, I will say, I am mostly active on Instagram.
[Closing music begins]
JASON: Same, same. You can find me on Instagram and Twitter, @jricochet. It’s the letter J and then the word ricochet. And same. I’m mostly active on Instagram.
LAURA: Cool.
JASON: And I think that’s it. Cool. Thanks so much for chatting, Laura.
LAURA: Thank you. This was fun.
JASON: Yeah. Everybody who’s listening, thank you so much for listening and until next episode. Bye.
LAURA: See ya!
JASON: This episode of Shit We’ve Read has been an Oblivion Geeks production hosted by Laura Benson and Jason Rico with music by Joshua Chilton.
LAURA: To join the discussion on this and all other books we’ve read, find us @shitweveread on Instagram, Facebook and Twitter.
JASON: For episode transcripts and more information about us, please visit shitweveread.com.
LAURA: This podcast is part of the BYLO Network. Visit bylonetwork.com for more great geeky podcasts.
JASON: Thanks so much for listening.
— End of transcript —